SJG99 wrote:The thing with 2 year deals is that if the player does exceptionally well in the first year you can get a transfer fee for them, and if they do very badly at this level there are enough other clubs with similar budgets who'll take them off your hands.

Players in their last year will usually take playing elsewhere on loan over taking a wage when they have nothing to go to the season after.

It's rare we'll be stuck paying wages on someone who can't get a deal anywhere else - as we proved by shifting on entire squads in 2014, 2015 etc.

Two year deals also give the player more stability and it's an incentive to better players to come to us where in some areas (facilities etc) we might not be up to the standard of our rivals.

Also, If the current relative success with the likes of Day, Demetriou, Butler having been around for 2-3 years doesn't show the benefits of continuity, I don't know what will.

Nice to see a bit of sense on here. I don't imagine people are sad we signed Jamille Matt on a 2 year deal at 28 years old now, despite the fact he had never manged double figures in a season at League level before he joined us. If we'd signed him for a year, I have no doubt he'd be onto bigger money and a larger club this summer, and I wouldn't be able to blame him.

One of the biggest challenges at L2 level is continuity - because teams have to gamble on players, and because budgets are so precarious, it's extremely difficult to get to a position where you sell a player for a fee unless they are academy superstars. In order to protect yourself against losing the diamonds you find from the rough, you have to be pragmatic and I'm actually glad to see us signing 2 year deals rather than 1 - it lets us plan better. Of course, olwsabout is not wrong to say a 1+1year deal would be more preferable still, but I'd still prefer a 2-year deal to a straightforward 1-year deal.

Feels like the lemar Reynolds deal all over again. Head scratcher. Good luck to the lad I hope it works out well for him and be a nice story unfortunately I could see him returning to non league by xmas. Personally hope signings like this don't block the progress of Tourey and Collins.

All player transfers are a bit of a lottery, but IMHO this is nothing like Lamar Reynolds, who had only played at something like level 11 or 12 IIRC before he came to us.

Corey has been playing at a National League side who finished just outside the playoffs last season, and prior to Ebbsfleet was at D&R in the National League. So he's played just one level below us for the last 3 or 4 years. We had about half a dozen that easily made the step up to league level. Pipe, O'Connor, Washington, Hughes, Flynn, Evans. So the hope is he turns out like one of those rather than a Jolley.

Bush wrote:Feels like the lemar Reynolds deal all over again. Head scratcher. Good luck to the lad I hope it works out well for him and be a nice story unfortunately I could see him returning to non league by xmas. Personally hope signings like this don't block the progress of Tourey and Collins.

What a bizarre comment.

rncfc wrote:

Bush wrote:Feels like the lemar Reynolds deal all over again. Head scratcher. Good luck to the lad I hope it works out well for him and be a nice story unfortunately I could see him returning to non league by xmas. Personally hope signings like this don't block the progress of Tourey and Collins.

What a bizarre comment.

Serious question. Bush makes his points. Firstly that players coming up from lower Leagues often don't make the grade and whilst he hopes the lad is a success he fears that such a signing might hinder the progress of developing players already on County's books.

Why do you think that a bizarre comment? If you give reasons why you believe it's a bizarre comment then it adds to the debate And if he so wishes gives Bush a chance to respond. If you just say 'bizarre comment it sounds like petulance.

Stan A. Einstein wrote:

rncfc wrote:

Bush wrote:Feels like the lemar Reynolds deal all over again. Head scratcher. Good luck to the lad I hope it works out well for him and be a nice story unfortunately I could see him returning to non league by xmas. Personally hope signings like this don't block the progress of Tourey and Collins.

What a bizarre comment.

Serious question. Bush makes his points. Firstly that players coming up from lower Leagues often don't make the grade and whilst he hopes the lad is a success he fears that such a signing might hinder the progress of developing players already on County's books.

Why do you think that a bizarre comment? If you give reasons why you believe it's a bizarre comment then it adds to the debate And if he so wishes gives Bush a chance to respond. If you just say 'bizarre comment it sounds like petulance.

Can't speak for rncfc but my interpretation would be: Lamar came to us as a raw youngster with no background in the pro game aside from a stint in the Vardy academy thing. Whitely is arriving with us having scored double figures in the division below last season. These things are not very alike.

njbh86 wrote:
Can't speak for rncfc but my interpretation would be: Lamar came to us as a raw youngster with no background in the pro game aside from a stint in the Vardy academy thing. Whitely is arriving with us having scored double figures in the division below last season. These things are not very alike.

That's perfectly valid. Whether it makes Bush's comments bizarre is perhaps not proven. But that's not the issue I was raising. We all have opinions. If we back up those opinions with argument then arguments can be challenged. But you can't debate a bare assertion.

Tell me if you think I'm wrong. But I find a reasoned argument I disagree with far more interesting that a suggestion I agree with but which merely reaches a conclusion without any thought.

Think you are missing my point. My point is it’s similar to the Reynolds deal as in we seem to have paid money for a player that we didn’t need to.

In the Reynolds deal we said we paid money yet his club denied it and in this deal the club were trying to get rid of all their players for free yet we seem to have paid money for him. Like I said both head scratchers.

by Bush » Wed Jun 26, 2019 1:04 pm
Feels like the lemar Reynolds deal all over again. Head scratcher. Good luck to the lad I hope it works out well for him and be a nice story unfortunately I could see him returning to non league by xmas. Personally hope signings like this don't block the progress of Tourey and Collins.

Your comparison with Reynolds isn't really fair. Reynolds jumped up 3 or 4 divisions when we signed him but Corey is just jumping up 1 level.

We should be looking in the Conference for new players. There are some decent players in there who could do a great job for us. Dan Butler and Mark Byrne were great players for us and we signed them both from Conference clubs.

Snowman wrote:

by Bush » Wed Jun 26, 2019 1:04 pm
Feels like the lemar Reynolds deal all over again. Head scratcher. Good luck to the lad I hope it works out well for him and be a nice story unfortunately I could see him returning to non league by xmas. Personally hope signings like this don't block the progress of Tourey and Collins.

Your comparison with Reynolds isn't really fair. Reynolds jumped up 3 or 4 divisions when we signed him but Corey is just jumping up 1 level.

We should be looking in the Conference for new players. There are some decent players in there who could do a great job for us. Dan Butler and Mark Byrne were great players for us and we signed them both from Conference clubs.

I assume you haven’t read what my comparison was. You can’t compare them as players apart from the fact both have never played league football. I would have issues with a 28 year old stepping up to league football for the first time. Can’t compare them to Byrne and butler who were younger and previously played league football. I have no problem with signing from the lower league infact I think we should do it more but 2 year contracts and paying for 28 year old unproven league players I am unsure about. I am unsure on how many 28 year olds playing league football for the first time have been a success. And my other point still stands that with two talented youngsters we should be investing in I hope they don’t miss out now. End of the day those two are the players that will make this club money. Can’t keep relying on cup runs.

Is there really that much of a difference in standard from top non league to league 2...... i think not

Countymadbell wrote:Is there really that much of a difference in standard from top non league to league 2...... i think not

No there’s not. But there is a huge gap from the conference and a team that sees itself as a league two promotion challenging team.

Last season's National League 12th placed Bromley, are no way even close to comparable over a season to League Two's 12th placed Crewe Alexandra.
The gulf is considerable in my view.

newgroundrodney wrote:Last season's National League 12th placed Bromley, are no way even close to comparable over a season to League Two's 12th placed Crewe Alexandra.
The gulf is considerable in my view.

Surely what we should be assessing is the quality of players and whether the better players in the National League would make it in the League.

Cornish Exile wrote:

newgroundrodney wrote:Last season's National League 12th placed Bromley, are no way even close to comparable over a season to League Two's 12th placed Crewe Alexandra.
The gulf is considerable in my view.

Surely what we should be assessing is the quality of players and whether the better players in the National League would make it in the League.

To a degree that's the point that is being made. The difference between league 2 and the National league is marginal.

But the difference between Tiger Woods at his best and the club pro at Pontypool is marginal. Faced with a six foot put Tiger Woods will sink it nine times in ten, the club pro just eight. Faced with a bunker shot Tiger gets out ten out of ten, the club pro just nine. And so on. Tiger goes around in 68 the club pro in 74.

The same with footballers. A prolific scorer at Conference level can't produce the same consistency at League 2 level. O'Connor?Jolly?

Some can step up many can't. And the truth is until you try you just don't know.

The only striker we brought in of late who produced at our current level previously was Amond. With him it was a fair bet he would continue to produce. My view is that of course we need to take the chance with players up from non league but not every or even the majority of signings should be coming from an untried level.