What is the problem?
The issue is the huge and rising scale of immigration (a record 1.1 million residence visas were granted to non-UK nationals in year to mid-2022) .
Immigration added around seven million to the UK population in the two decades up to 2020 – accounting for over four-fifths of total growth.
Mass immigration places mounting pressure on already-overstretched public services. There were nearly 700,000 new GP registrations by migrants in 2019/20.
Record immigration requires a home to be built in England every five minutes to meet the skyrocketing demand for homes.
An extensive body of research has consistently found that immigration is a huge cost to the UK Treasury (£13 billion per year - UCL study, 2014/15) – with non-EU immigration (which is presently the fastest rising tranche of immigration) having the biggest fiscal costs.
Six in ten of the public support reducing immigration (Deltapoll) and nearly 8 in 10 say the government is handling immigration poorly (YouGov).
Demos found in 2018 that about three-quarters of the public considered that immigration had increased divisions.
Politicians’ repeated promises to reduce and control immigration have been blatantly abandoned and betrayed, harming voter trust and democracy itself.
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
2Mrs cathedral is an immigrant doing skilled and vital work (90% of her colleagues are 'immigrants'), all the immigrants I know/know of are not only in work but work darn hard putting us Brits to shame frankly usually in jobs us Brits can't/don't/won't do (the children of recent immigrants usually outperform British kids too) - without immigrants this country would be stuffed - BUT we do need to have a fair and transparent system (my choice would be an Australian/NZ points based model - albeit they have the advantage of being 1000's of miles from most anywhere so controlling immigration is far easier!) - the unqualified or exploited being brought in to feed organised crime are NOT those we want.Torquay Exile wrote: September 21st, 2023, 10:08 pm What is the problem?
The issue is the huge and rising scale of immigration (a record 1.1 million residence visas were granted to non-UK nationals in year to mid-2022) .
Immigration added around seven million to the UK population in the two decades up to 2020 – accounting for over four-fifths of total growth.
Mass immigration places mounting pressure on already-overstretched public services. There were nearly 700,000 new GP registrations by migrants in 2019/20.
Record immigration requires a home to be built in England every five minutes to meet the skyrocketing demand for homes.
An extensive body of research has consistently found that immigration is a huge cost to the UK Treasury (£13 billion per year - UCL study, 2014/15) – with non-EU immigration (which is presently the fastest rising tranche of immigration) having the biggest fiscal costs.
Six in ten of the public support reducing immigration (Deltapoll) and nearly 8 in 10 say the government is handling immigration poorly (YouGov).
Demos found in 2018 that about three-quarters of the public considered that immigration had increased divisions.
Politicians’ repeated promises to reduce and control immigration have been blatantly abandoned and betrayed, harming voter trust and democracy itself.
If you [an immigrant] have skills we need - come in bring your family and settle - if not sorry guys its a no - that should be the approach along with taking a limited a number of refugees. All far easier said than done of course.
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
3Illegal immigrants arrive for 2 reasons, because they have a place to live, and a job in the black economy to pay the costs of being trafficked........CathedralCounty wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 9:43 amMrs cathedral is an immigrant doing skilled and vital work (90% of her colleagues are 'immigrants'), all the immigrants I know/know of are not only in work but work darn hard putting us Brits to shame frankly usually in jobs us Brits can't/don't/won't do (the children of recent immigrants usually outperform British kids too) - without immigrants this country would be stuffed - BUT we do need to have a fair and transparent system (my choice would be an Australian/NZ points based model - albeit they have the advantage of being 1000's of miles from most anywhere so controlling immigration is far easier!) - the unqualified or exploited being brought in to feed organised crime are NOT those we want.Torquay Exile wrote: September 21st, 2023, 10:08 pm What is the problem?
The issue is the huge and rising scale of immigration (a record 1.1 million residence visas were granted to non-UK nationals in year to mid-2022) .
Immigration added around seven million to the UK population in the two decades up to 2020 – accounting for over four-fifths of total growth.
Mass immigration places mounting pressure on already-overstretched public services. There were nearly 700,000 new GP registrations by migrants in 2019/20.
Record immigration requires a home to be built in England every five minutes to meet the skyrocketing demand for homes.
An extensive body of research has consistently found that immigration is a huge cost to the UK Treasury (£13 billion per year - UCL study, 2014/15) – with non-EU immigration (which is presently the fastest rising tranche of immigration) having the biggest fiscal costs.
Six in ten of the public support reducing immigration (Deltapoll) and nearly 8 in 10 say the government is handling immigration poorly (YouGov).
Demos found in 2018 that about three-quarters of the public considered that immigration had increased divisions.
Politicians’ repeated promises to reduce and control immigration have been blatantly abandoned and betrayed, harming voter trust and democracy itself.
If you [an immigrant] have skills we need - come in bring your family and settle - if not sorry guys its a no - that should be the approach along with taking a limited a number of refugees. All far easier said than done of course.
Asylum seekers have neither a job or a place to live at their starting place, and so have nothing to lose.........
Skilled labour is attracted simply by salary, why do you need a points system?
Simply because it's to pretend that Goverment bodies like the NHS, don't have to pay to attract trained staff to fill the gaps, and they are not part of the jobs market like everyone else.........
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
4I think while not a panacea a points based system is at least fair - under 30 - tick, English speaker - tick, degree educated - tick, skills shortage area qualified - tick, no criminal convictions - tick, etc illegal immigration is far harder to tackle and I don't have the answers but a points based system might help with targeted legal immigration.Bangitintrnet wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 11:56 amIllegal immigrants arrive for 2 reasons, because they have a place to live, and a job in the black economy to pay the costs of being trafficked........CathedralCounty wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 9:43 amMrs cathedral is an immigrant doing skilled and vital work (90% of her colleagues are 'immigrants'), all the immigrants I know/know of are not only in work but work darn hard putting us Brits to shame frankly usually in jobs us Brits can't/don't/won't do (the children of recent immigrants usually outperform British kids too) - without immigrants this country would be stuffed - BUT we do need to have a fair and transparent system (my choice would be an Australian/NZ points based model - albeit they have the advantage of being 1000's of miles from most anywhere so controlling immigration is far easier!) - the unqualified or exploited being brought in to feed organised crime are NOT those we want.Torquay Exile wrote: September 21st, 2023, 10:08 pm What is the problem?
The issue is the huge and rising scale of immigration (a record 1.1 million residence visas were granted to non-UK nationals in year to mid-2022) .
Immigration added around seven million to the UK population in the two decades up to 2020 – accounting for over four-fifths of total growth.
Mass immigration places mounting pressure on already-overstretched public services. There were nearly 700,000 new GP registrations by migrants in 2019/20.
Record immigration requires a home to be built in England every five minutes to meet the skyrocketing demand for homes.
An extensive body of research has consistently found that immigration is a huge cost to the UK Treasury (£13 billion per year - UCL study, 2014/15) – with non-EU immigration (which is presently the fastest rising tranche of immigration) having the biggest fiscal costs.
Six in ten of the public support reducing immigration (Deltapoll) and nearly 8 in 10 say the government is handling immigration poorly (YouGov).
Demos found in 2018 that about three-quarters of the public considered that immigration had increased divisions.
Politicians’ repeated promises to reduce and control immigration have been blatantly abandoned and betrayed, harming voter trust and democracy itself.
If you [an immigrant] have skills we need - come in bring your family and settle - if not sorry guys its a no - that should be the approach along with taking a limited a number of refugees. All far easier said than done of course.
Asylum seekers have neither a job or a place to live at their starting place, and so have nothing to lose.........
Skilled labour is attracted simply by salary, why do you need a points system?
Simply because it's to pretend that Goverment bodies like the NHS, don't have to pay to attract trained staff to fill the gaps, and they are not part of the jobs market like everyone else.........
Agree on NHS pay (not for doctors they earn more than enough but for many other grades its is appallingly low - we have far too many people in work who are in poverty - plain wrong). The NHS is a busted flush we need a hybrid system IMO but that is a whole other debate!
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
5CathedralCounty wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 12:34 pmI think while not a panacea a points based system is at least fair - under 30 - tick, English speaker - tick, degree educated - tick, skills shortage area qualified - tick, no criminal convictions - tick, etc illegal immigration is far harder to tackle and I don't have the answers but a points based system might help with targeted legal immigration.Bangitintrnet wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 11:56 amIllegal immigrants arrive for 2 reasons, because they have a place to live, and a job in the black economy to pay the costs of being trafficked........CathedralCounty wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 9:43 amMrs cathedral is an immigrant doing skilled and vital work (90% of her colleagues are 'immigrants'), all the immigrants I know/know of are not only in work but work darn hard putting us Brits to shame frankly usually in jobs us Brits can't/don't/won't do (the children of recent immigrants usually outperform British kids too) - without immigrants this country would be stuffed - BUT we do need to have a fair and transparent system (my choice would be an Australian/NZ points based model - albeit they have the advantage of being 1000's of miles from most anywhere so controlling immigration is far easier!) - the unqualified or exploited being brought in to feed organised crime are NOT those we want.Torquay Exile wrote: September 21st, 2023, 10:08 pm What is the problem?
The issue is the huge and rising scale of immigration (a record 1.1 million residence visas were granted to non-UK nationals in year to mid-2022) .
Immigration added around seven million to the UK population in the two decades up to 2020 – accounting for over four-fifths of total growth.
Mass immigration places mounting pressure on already-overstretched public services. There were nearly 700,000 new GP registrations by migrants in 2019/20.
Record immigration requires a home to be built in England every five minutes to meet the skyrocketing demand for homes.
An extensive body of research has consistently found that immigration is a huge cost to the UK Treasury (£13 billion per year - UCL study, 2014/15) – with non-EU immigration (which is presently the fastest rising tranche of immigration) having the biggest fiscal costs.
Six in ten of the public support reducing immigration (Deltapoll) and nearly 8 in 10 say the government is handling immigration poorly (YouGov).
Demos found in 2018 that about three-quarters of the public considered that immigration had increased divisions.
Politicians’ repeated promises to reduce and control immigration have been blatantly abandoned and betrayed, harming voter trust and democracy itself.
If you [an immigrant] have skills we need - come in bring your family and settle - if not sorry guys its a no - that should be the approach along with taking a limited a number of refugees. All far easier said than done of course.
Asylum seekers have neither a job or a place to live at their starting place, and so have nothing to lose.........
Skilled labour is attracted simply by salary, why do you need a points system?
Simply because it's to pretend that Goverment bodies like the NHS, don't have to pay to attract trained staff to fill the gaps, and they are not part of the jobs market like everyone else.........
Agree on NHS pay (not for doctors they earn more than enough but for many other grades its is appallingly low - we have far too many people in work who are in poverty - plain wrong). The NHS is a busted flush we need a hybrid system IMO but that is a whole other debate!
The only thing that helps to recruit skilled educated key workers from abroad is pay. They don't go to Qatar for the piss ups do they?
Point systems do nothing if the pay is not attractive, and the place where we have skill shortages is in the NHS and private care system.............
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
6Well 70% of my wife's skilled health industry colleagues are 'immigrants' so the pay must be a draw along with rule of law, stable (albeit not hot) weather, ease of getting around (in distance terms anyway), variety of coast/country/city attractions, generally decent people and a VERY [comparative to many societies] tolerant and diverse society.Bangitintrnet wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 2:28 pmCathedralCounty wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 12:34 pmI think while not a panacea a points based system is at least fair - under 30 - tick, English speaker - tick, degree educated - tick, skills shortage area qualified - tick, no criminal convictions - tick, etc illegal immigration is far harder to tackle and I don't have the answers but a points based system might help with targeted legal immigration.Bangitintrnet wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 11:56 amIllegal immigrants arrive for 2 reasons, because they have a place to live, and a job in the black economy to pay the costs of being trafficked........CathedralCounty wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 9:43 amMrs cathedral is an immigrant doing skilled and vital work (90% of her colleagues are 'immigrants'), all the immigrants I know/know of are not only in work but work darn hard putting us Brits to shame frankly usually in jobs us Brits can't/don't/won't do (the children of recent immigrants usually outperform British kids too) - without immigrants this country would be stuffed - BUT we do need to have a fair and transparent system (my choice would be an Australian/NZ points based model - albeit they have the advantage of being 1000's of miles from most anywhere so controlling immigration is far easier!) - the unqualified or exploited being brought in to feed organised crime are NOT those we want.Torquay Exile wrote: September 21st, 2023, 10:08 pm What is the problem?
The issue is the huge and rising scale of immigration (a record 1.1 million residence visas were granted to non-UK nationals in year to mid-2022) .
Immigration added around seven million to the UK population in the two decades up to 2020 – accounting for over four-fifths of total growth.
Mass immigration places mounting pressure on already-overstretched public services. There were nearly 700,000 new GP registrations by migrants in 2019/20.
Record immigration requires a home to be built in England every five minutes to meet the skyrocketing demand for homes.
An extensive body of research has consistently found that immigration is a huge cost to the UK Treasury (£13 billion per year - UCL study, 2014/15) – with non-EU immigration (which is presently the fastest rising tranche of immigration) having the biggest fiscal costs.
Six in ten of the public support reducing immigration (Deltapoll) and nearly 8 in 10 say the government is handling immigration poorly (YouGov).
Demos found in 2018 that about three-quarters of the public considered that immigration had increased divisions.
Politicians’ repeated promises to reduce and control immigration have been blatantly abandoned and betrayed, harming voter trust and democracy itself.
If you [an immigrant] have skills we need - come in bring your family and settle - if not sorry guys its a no - that should be the approach along with taking a limited a number of refugees. All far easier said than done of course.
Asylum seekers have neither a job or a place to live at their starting place, and so have nothing to lose.........
Skilled labour is attracted simply by salary, why do you need a points system?
Simply because it's to pretend that Goverment bodies like the NHS, don't have to pay to attract trained staff to fill the gaps, and they are not part of the jobs market like everyone else.........
Agree on NHS pay (not for doctors they earn more than enough but for many other grades its is appallingly low - we have far too many people in work who are in poverty - plain wrong). The NHS is a busted flush we need a hybrid system IMO but that is a whole other debate!
The only thing that helps to recruit skilled educated key workers from abroad is pay. They don't go to Qatar for the piss ups do they?
Point systems do nothing if the pay is not attractive, and the place where we have skill shortages is in the NHS and private care system.............
I'm no drum banger for the UK which is far from perfect, but its obviously a very attractive place for immigrants legal or otherwise.
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
7I'm all for immigration. Those that come in legally "Yes". Those that have paid gangs (want to be gangsters) "No". If they can afford to pay these gangs to come into the country illegally and they have nothing to hide. Then go through the right channels, has I'm sure lots of other people have done. It might that little bit longer, but at least we and they would know that they have the right to stay in our country.
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
8They can't afford to pay the gangs, that's why they end up as slaves.....Torquay Exile wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 6:01 pm I'm all for immigration. Those that come in legally "Yes". Those that have paid gangs (want to be gangsters) "No". If they can afford to pay these gangs to come into the country illegally and they have nothing to hide. Then go through the right channels, has I'm sure lots of other people have done. It might that little bit longer, but at least we and they would know that they have the right to stay in our country.
It is not driven by the gangs, its driven by someone who wants a restaurant but can't get it, or staff, in the normal way.........
In and around the world wars those of Jewish faith were despised in Germany and elsewhere, for having their own access to finance, that the locals didn't.
Likewise Chinese migrants and others had financial help from their compatriots in starting life in the UK.
In previous times the English dominated access to ports around the globe, and the Scottish and Irish drove inland to develop what was known as the British Empire. However wealth is driven by people, being rich is driven by abiilty to access other people's money, while not spending. Great wealth is accumulated by slaves....................
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
9Bangitintrnet wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 7:17 pmThey can't afford to pay the gangs, that's why they end up as slaves.....Torquay Exile wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 6:01 pm I'm all for immigration. Those that come in legally "Yes". Those that have paid gangs (want to be gangsters) "No". If they can afford to pay these gangs to come into the country illegally and they have nothing to hide. Then go through the right channels, has I'm sure lots of other people have done. It might that little bit longer, but at least we and they would know that they have the right to stay in our country.
It is not driven by the gangs, its driven by someone who wants a restaurant but can't get it, or staff, in the normal way.........
Maybe not all of them were paying the gangs (want to be gangsters), but quite a few did or do pay upfront. Maybe it would be a good idea to question the immigrants (wanderers). If they are genuine and have nothing to hide they wouldn't mind being questioned. And of course they wouldn't have destroyed their identification documents (Passports, official document issued by a government) would they.
There is a song that springs to mind, I better not say, just in case someone says that I'm being a racist.
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
10Not sure if you are nieve, or have just sucked up stuff from a political forum.Torquay Exile wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 7:48 pmBangitintrnet wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 7:17 pmThey can't afford to pay the gangs, that's why they end up as slaves.....Torquay Exile wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 6:01 pm I'm all for immigration. Those that come in legally "Yes". Those that have paid gangs (want to be gangsters) "No". If they can afford to pay these gangs to come into the country illegally and they have nothing to hide. Then go through the right channels, has I'm sure lots of other people have done. It might that little bit longer, but at least we and they would know that they have the right to stay in our country.
It is not driven by the gangs, its driven by someone who wants a restaurant but can't get it, or staff, in the normal way.........
Maybe not all of them were paying the gangs (want to be gangsters), but quite a few did or do pay upfront. Maybe it would be a good idea to question the immigrants (wanderers). If they are genuine and have nothing to hide they wouldn't mind being questioned. And of course they wouldn't have destroyed their identification documents (Passports, official document issued by a government) would they.
There is a song that springs to mind, I better not say, just in case someone says that I'm being a racist.
If anyone claims asylum they are doing so because they have nothing to lose at home, that includes a passport, their not going on holiday........
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
11Bangitintrnet wrote: September 23rd, 2023, 7:25 pmNot sure if you are nieve, or have just sucked up stuff from a political forum.Torquay Exile wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 7:48 pmBangitintrnet wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 7:17 pmThey can't afford to pay the gangs, that's why they end up as slaves.....Torquay Exile wrote: September 22nd, 2023, 6:01 pm I'm all for immigration. Those that come in legally "Yes". Those that have paid gangs (want to be gangsters) "No". If they can afford to pay these gangs to come into the country illegally and they have nothing to hide. Then go through the right channels, has I'm sure lots of other people have done. It might that little bit longer, but at least we and they would know that they have the right to stay in our country.
It is not driven by the gangs, its driven by someone who wants a restaurant but can't get it, or staff, in the normal way.........
Maybe not all of them were paying the gangs (want to be gangsters), but quite a few did or do pay upfront. Maybe it would be a good idea to question the immigrants (wanderers). If they are genuine and have nothing to hide they wouldn't mind being questioned. And of course they wouldn't have destroyed their identification documents (Passports, official document issued by a government) would they.
There is a song that springs to mind, I better not say, just in case someone says that I'm being a racist.
If anyone claims asylum they are doing so because they have nothing to lose at home, that includes a passport, their not going on holiday........
(Nieve” is actually the Spanish word for “snow.”)
If you are going to use the word naive you need to use the correct spelling or maybe you're spanish and have not got a clue how to use the English language (did you know the word nieve means Snow in Spanish) and of course we all know that when Snow melts it turns water. Is that what you are very wet behind the ears. Every time I read your posts you never fail to amuse me. Your post today really made me laugh.
Maybe you should do a lot more research before you post Mr Nieve (you plonker) I mean Mr Naive
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
12Interesting to see that France & Germany are starting to take action to try and stem the flow of migrants from Italy. Plus of course you have Austria, Denmark, Hungary, Latvia, Poland and Slovakia who won't take any migrants at all.
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
13This is what illegal immigration brings to the United Kingdom (see the link below). I'm not saying all immigrants are the same. But a lot of them are here to disrupt and interfere with the way our Country is run. That is why I say if they are illegal send them back to the safe Country that they came from, which just happens to be France.
This is how I see how allowing immigrants into to our Country should work. Let's negotiate with France on allowing us (United Kingdom) to have a military base in their Country, to register every one who would like come to our Country (to live permanently or those who would like to work in our Country Temporarily). In order for that to work we would need access to all records of everyone from whichever Country they have come from (birth certificate, passports, criminal records, and so on). That is the only way that I can see it working and it would be fair on everyone.
https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/ ... avon-club/
This is how I see how allowing immigrants into to our Country should work. Let's negotiate with France on allowing us (United Kingdom) to have a military base in their Country, to register every one who would like come to our Country (to live permanently or those who would like to work in our Country Temporarily). In order for that to work we would need access to all records of everyone from whichever Country they have come from (birth certificate, passports, criminal records, and so on). That is the only way that I can see it working and it would be fair on everyone.
https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/news/ ... avon-club/
Re: Immigration What is the problem?
15Bangitintrnet wrote: October 1st, 2023, 6:32 pm https://www.indy100.com/news/refugees-m ... r-b1965324
You are using links from 2021 Written By Liam O'Dell. Where as I put a link on here for 2023 a true account of what is happening right across the United Kingdom Written By Iwan Gabe Davies who writes for the South Wales Argus. Where you have put a link of an article, as I have stated that was written in 2021 Spoken by Lord Kerr from The House of Lords in London.
Also you haven't give me your opinion on what I have written, do you agree or disagree?
I would love to hear what you have to say on how immigration should work in your opinion or even how immigration should be controlled in the future (do you even have an opinion).
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