CathedralCounty wrote: May 9th, 2022, 9:06 am

Stan A. Einstein wrote: May 8th, 2022, 4:53 pm How many EFL clubs are tenants of the rugby club in their town or city? I can't find any. As I have said I think it makes good sense to share with the rugby, I think that being beholden to the rugby is a recipe for disaster.

How without Lotto Les and far fewer attendees will we avoid going into a 1980s like death spiral?


Now can you answer my questions?

Think in an albeit convoluted way via a management company Coventry City are tenants of the rugby club in their town or city - equally a number of clubs share grounds with rugby teams and/or play at grounds they don't own - we have a possible but improbable chance of going down next season - but feel we are looking up rather than down and if we did [get relegated] we'd cross that bridge over the Usk when we came to it

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 10:34 am

pembsexile wrote: May 9th, 2022, 9:03 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 8th, 2022, 2:18 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 8th, 2022, 1:00 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 8th, 2022, 12:07 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 7th, 2022, 6:06 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 7th, 2022, 10:48 am

pembsexile wrote: May 7th, 2022, 10:11 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 7th, 2022, 9:46 am Oh dear oh dear oh dear

We have an abulance chaser looking for a disaster to hang his big project on, and his right hand man simply diverting attention. Pathetic.

Yet another straw man argument.

Diverting attention? Have a look at my post on this thread at 9.43am yesterday where I responded to you.

Exactly, precisely.
Has it never a occurred to you that the County are in the best situation that they could be. I. E. Having a landlord that requires them in order to make the ground viable? Just think about that..........

Now I don't know if the ground is viable with just the County as the sole user, but I know for sure that it isn't viable without them.

Now Consider Coventry City, owned Highfield Road. Wanted a bigger ground and the Council wanted them to move, hence the Rioch. Attendence fell to the point where the stadium wasn't viable for them and the owners (a charitable trust and the local council) and they had to move away until it became viable again.

Now consider Newport Rugby, no longer viable to play at RP moved away, doing better.

Also consider Bristol City and the Bristol Bears that play there. They lost the memorial ground to Bristol Rovers, who has done better?

You are falling into Stans trap of believing that because the ownership of RP is with the WRU, that they wish to do us harm, and that is the basis of the discussion. It simply isn't an argument that has any merit.


Why don't you consider the evidence, the WRU are just a landlord looking after something that needs to be viable.

I have studied planning in Wales, which is important, because planning is devolved, and I know what is required even to get to outline planning consent. The Council moved various sports to Spytty, but always provided an alternative
Facility. So to build on RP the first thing they would require is where is the alternative facility being constructed and detail benifit, and the need of the realeasd site. Road network and access statements. A community statement, an environmental impact assessment, etc, etc.

Another thing to consider is that the WRU pay 80% of each of the Regions Welsh players wages. So the income that the Regions receive from bums on seats is far less.

The bottom line is this. We don't require cement, when what we are bringing to the table makes the venue viable.

What on earth do you mean by ‘Precisely. Exactly’? My previous comment could hardly be construed to mean that I was diverting attention from a serious issue could it? I just wish some people on here (not just you) would refer to what people actually say, instead of what they think people say. Furthermore, other people, including you used the word cement in their post before I did. Cementing our position as the premier sporting club in Newport is a sound proposition. How do we do that is the question.

I think I made it quite clear in my post yesterday that I am certainly not a planning expert but I do have opinions and ideas. Nothing more, nothing less. Certainly no diversionary tactics from me.

Quote from Stan....

Morning Colin,

My plan is really simple.

First step is that we acknowledge the problem.

Second step is that we politely explain to those who wish to bury their heads in the sand, that that is no longer an option.

Third step is that we speak to all the clubs who have developed their own stadiums and ask them how they managed to do it. What worked and as importantly what didn't.

Step four is to engage with the fan base and start to work towards our aim, together.

Step five is we listen to everyone who wants to help.

Step 6. We ignore those who are so narrow minded that they believe nothing can be done

Now that sets the tone of there is a problem, and the solution to solving it, is speaking to clubs about how to develop their own stadium, nothing else is to be considered.
Torquay Exile asks a question of Stan, and you respond on his behalf. So Torquay Exile asks if you are Stan? and gets abused. That's diversion.

Then I am not allowed by you to ask the question, why is cementing a relationship at Rodney Parade a unique problem to County when ground shares happen regularly all around the Country? You refuse to answer, by basically telling me I am not allowed to ask that, as the question should be how can WE do so? Ignoring the point that I am making, that we have already. Then you complain about my use of the word Cement. Again this is just diversion.

If you and Stan spent some time researching what clubs are doing now, they are sharing. Why are they doing that, and ignoring the holy grail of cementing sporting supremacy?

It appears that you like to twist what I actually say to suit your own narrative. That is your prerogative. Read again what I have said on this thread and there is no way that I have told you that you are not allowed to ask anything. You have completely made this up. I, or anyone else have no right to say to anyone that they are not allowed to ask a question. What I have done is suggest an alternative question. People do it all the time. That is completely different to what you suggest.

Furthermore, I have not complained about your use of the word cement. In the context it is being used, it is a good word. I even used it myself after other people had. I am merely pointing out that it had been used by others. You jump on it and say it is a diversion tactic. Absolute nonsense.

The start of this thread made the point that the WRU may be looking to cut the number of Welsh clubs to three from four. I wonder who the favourite for revamping/reorganising/culling are? That concerns me.

So that people understand my view and It doesn’t get twisted, here it is:

We have been fortunate since 2012 to have an agreement with Dragons, then WRU to use RP (Tfft). I am glad we moved there. I was there yesterday along with over 5300 others supporting our team. I used to even go over to see the Dragons some years ago but don’t anymore. They are on a bad (seemingly inescapable) slide unfortunately. In the context of ground sharing our fortunes are inextricably linked to them. There is no escaping that. We are the prime tenant at the moment and probably contribute more money than the Dragons. What happens if we slide into the Conference?

What about the future?

As far as priorities go, our number one priority next season should be cementing our position as Newport’s premier sporting club by trying to ensure that we carry on with L2 survival. That is paramount. Whilst important, anything else is secondary.

Again, why is sliding into the conference a problem in relation to Rodney Parade? we have played there before in the conference rather successfully, and made the ground viable. I'm not arguing that we should try to be in the Conference, just why is it a problem?

My argument about cementing our position as Newport premier sporting club is what difference does it make?

If as you say our relationship at Rodney Parade concerns you, what do you have against researching why ground shares happen regularly all around the Country?

Don't you want to know the answer?

I completely understand that you are not arguing that we should try to be in the National league (Conference). No one who is a County fan would want that.

With the associated fall in revenue, I believe that sliding into the National league (Conference) would be a backward step. Probable dwindling support, lower club income and facing an uphill struggle to get back in the league.

In my previous post I said (Tfft) that we have been ground sharing with the rugby at RP for a decade. If we hadn’t gone to RP I don’t think we would have had the relatively few good years in L2. The status quo is working as it is. It is not perfect, it is not ideal but at this stage it is the best we can get. Ground sharing works for us at the moment.

My concerns are twofold;

1 Given the article in the Times about the possibility of the WRU culling one club in Wales, the probability (not certainty) is that one of the teams will be the Dragons. Our future is linked with them as at the moment we appear to be the primary tenant (financially). They appear to be going backwards unfortunately. If they go, in the eyes of our Landlord, is RP sustainable with only a football club paying rent? We will never know what is inside their heads but I cannot see the WRU in that event saying yes, we should support the County at RP. I sincerely hope that the Dragons improve. Two clubs can be catered for at RP.

2. Our recent form is dire. If that carries on into next season there is more than a real possibility that we could find ourselves heading towards the National league with all the disadvantages that holds. It is of paramount importance that we retain L2 status at the end of next season. I just hope we get the right players in.

If ground sharing works for other clubs, then good on them. If it ain’t broke, then why fix it. Unfortunately, we could be heading in the need to ‘fix it’ direction.

When we were last in the Conference and then went to RP, the Dragons were successful. They had far larger crowds than us. It was not a perfect relationship but it worked. It was viable and in the interest of the WRU at that time that it worked. Will it still be viable in a few years? It is the future that concerns me.

I understand the concern, but they are pretty much a model landlord.
Did they have to organise the investment in the pitch? - no they didn't.
Did they have to organise the investment in new electronic advertising? - no they didn't

Who does it benefit? - it's mutual benefit isn't it, as we are by far the main user of those facilities.

Think of the WRU as a facility provider. They provide the facilities for us to use and make money, and we rent those facilities.

The last board minutes confirmed that the club has made a profit for the last 4 seasons. We are hardly being screwed are we? The minutes also confirmed that the electronic advertising sales were up, and most of next season sorted. Mutual benefit.

Now if we are relegated, it's possible that we won't need to rent some of that electronic advertising. Mutual loss, etc, etc.

The WRU are business orientated, they will look at what we offer, and what alternatives they have, and weigh up whether it would be better for us to say swap grounds with Newport Rugby. Now having just levered them out, do you think they would be in any rush to invite them back? Will they rent more facilities than County do?

Flexibility is the way to survive, Coventry have learnt that the hard way. County had to be more than flexible as well. It's sad then to note what happened to the ground owners at Moreton in the Marsh and Gloucester.

pembsexile wrote: May 9th, 2022, 11:52 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 10:34 am

pembsexile wrote: May 9th, 2022, 9:03 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 8th, 2022, 2:18 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 8th, 2022, 1:00 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 8th, 2022, 12:07 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 7th, 2022, 6:06 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 7th, 2022, 10:48 am

pembsexile wrote: May 7th, 2022, 10:11 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 7th, 2022, 9:46 am Oh dear oh dear oh dear

We have an abulance chaser looking for a disaster to hang his big project on, and his right hand man simply diverting attention. Pathetic.

Yet another straw man argument.

Diverting attention? Have a look at my post on this thread at 9.43am yesterday where I responded to you.

Exactly, precisely.
Has it never a occurred to you that the County are in the best situation that they could be. I. E. Having a landlord that requires them in order to make the ground viable? Just think about that..........

Now I don't know if the ground is viable with just the County as the sole user, but I know for sure that it isn't viable without them.

Now Consider Coventry City, owned Highfield Road. Wanted a bigger ground and the Council wanted them to move, hence the Rioch. Attendence fell to the point where the stadium wasn't viable for them and the owners (a charitable trust and the local council) and they had to move away until it became viable again.

Now consider Newport Rugby, no longer viable to play at RP moved away, doing better.

Also consider Bristol City and the Bristol Bears that play there. They lost the memorial ground to Bristol Rovers, who has done better?

You are falling into Stans trap of believing that because the ownership of RP is with the WRU, that they wish to do us harm, and that is the basis of the discussion. It simply isn't an argument that has any merit.


Why don't you consider the evidence, the WRU are just a landlord looking after something that needs to be viable.

I have studied planning in Wales, which is important, because planning is devolved, and I know what is required even to get to outline planning consent. The Council moved various sports to Spytty, but always provided an alternative
Facility. So to build on RP the first thing they would require is where is the alternative facility being constructed and detail benifit, and the need of the realeasd site. Road network and access statements. A community statement, an environmental impact assessment, etc, etc.

Another thing to consider is that the WRU pay 80% of each of the Regions Welsh players wages. So the income that the Regions receive from bums on seats is far less.

The bottom line is this. We don't require cement, when what we are bringing to the table makes the venue viable.

What on earth do you mean by ‘Precisely. Exactly’? My previous comment could hardly be construed to mean that I was diverting attention from a serious issue could it? I just wish some people on here (not just you) would refer to what people actually say, instead of what they think people say. Furthermore, other people, including you used the word cement in their post before I did. Cementing our position as the premier sporting club in Newport is a sound proposition. How do we do that is the question.

I think I made it quite clear in my post yesterday that I am certainly not a planning expert but I do have opinions and ideas. Nothing more, nothing less. Certainly no diversionary tactics from me.

Quote from Stan....

Morning Colin,

My plan is really simple.

First step is that we acknowledge the problem.

Second step is that we politely explain to those who wish to bury their heads in the sand, that that is no longer an option.

Third step is that we speak to all the clubs who have developed their own stadiums and ask them how they managed to do it. What worked and as importantly what didn't.

Step four is to engage with the fan base and start to work towards our aim, together.

Step five is we listen to everyone who wants to help.

Step 6. We ignore those who are so narrow minded that they believe nothing can be done

Now that sets the tone of there is a problem, and the solution to solving it, is speaking to clubs about how to develop their own stadium, nothing else is to be considered.
Torquay Exile asks a question of Stan, and you respond on his behalf. So Torquay Exile asks if you are Stan? and gets abused. That's diversion.

Then I am not allowed by you to ask the question, why is cementing a relationship at Rodney Parade a unique problem to County when ground shares happen regularly all around the Country? You refuse to answer, by basically telling me I am not allowed to ask that, as the question should be how can WE do so? Ignoring the point that I am making, that we have already. Then you complain about my use of the word Cement. Again this is just diversion.

If you and Stan spent some time researching what clubs are doing now, they are sharing. Why are they doing that, and ignoring the holy grail of cementing sporting supremacy?

It appears that you like to twist what I actually say to suit your own narrative. That is your prerogative. Read again what I have said on this thread and there is no way that I have told you that you are not allowed to ask anything. You have completely made this up. I, or anyone else have no right to say to anyone that they are not allowed to ask a question. What I have done is suggest an alternative question. People do it all the time. That is completely different to what you suggest.

Furthermore, I have not complained about your use of the word cement. In the context it is being used, it is a good word. I even used it myself after other people had. I am merely pointing out that it had been used by others. You jump on it and say it is a diversion tactic. Absolute nonsense.

The start of this thread made the point that the WRU may be looking to cut the number of Welsh clubs to three from four. I wonder who the favourite for revamping/reorganising/culling are? That concerns me.

So that people understand my view and It doesn’t get twisted, here it is:

We have been fortunate since 2012 to have an agreement with Dragons, then WRU to use RP (Tfft). I am glad we moved there. I was there yesterday along with over 5300 others supporting our team. I used to even go over to see the Dragons some years ago but don’t anymore. They are on a bad (seemingly inescapable) slide unfortunately. In the context of ground sharing our fortunes are inextricably linked to them. There is no escaping that. We are the prime tenant at the moment and probably contribute more money than the Dragons. What happens if we slide into the Conference?

What about the future?

As far as priorities go, our number one priority next season should be cementing our position as Newport’s premier sporting club by trying to ensure that we carry on with L2 survival. That is paramount. Whilst important, anything else is secondary.

Again, why is sliding into the conference a problem in relation to Rodney Parade? we have played there before in the conference rather successfully, and made the ground viable. I'm not arguing that we should try to be in the Conference, just why is it a problem?

My argument about cementing our position as Newport premier sporting club is what difference does it make?

If as you say our relationship at Rodney Parade concerns you, what do you have against researching why ground shares happen regularly all around the Country?

Don't you want to know the answer?

I completely understand that you are not arguing that we should try to be in the National league (Conference). No one who is a County fan would want that.

With the associated fall in revenue, I believe that sliding into the National league (Conference) would be a backward step. Probable dwindling support, lower club income and facing an uphill struggle to get back in the league.

In my previous post I said (Tfft) that we have been ground sharing with the rugby at RP for a decade. If we hadn’t gone to RP I don’t think we would have had the relatively few good years in L2. The status quo is working as it is. It is not perfect, it is not ideal but at this stage it is the best we can get. Ground sharing works for us at the moment.

My concerns are twofold;

1 Given the article in the Times about the possibility of the WRU culling one club in Wales, the probability (not certainty) is that one of the teams will be the Dragons. Our future is linked with them as at the moment we appear to be the primary tenant (financially). They appear to be going backwards unfortunately. If they go, in the eyes of our Landlord, is RP sustainable with only a football club paying rent? We will never know what is inside their heads but I cannot see the WRU in that event saying yes, we should support the County at RP. I sincerely hope that the Dragons improve. Two clubs can be catered for at RP.

2. Our recent form is dire. If that carries on into next season there is more than a real possibility that we could find ourselves heading towards the National league with all the disadvantages that holds. It is of paramount importance that we retain L2 status at the end of next season. I just hope we get the right players in.

If ground sharing works for other clubs, then good on them. If it ain’t broke, then why fix it. Unfortunately, we could be heading in the need to ‘fix it’ direction.

When we were last in the Conference and then went to RP, the Dragons were successful. They had far larger crowds than us. It was not a perfect relationship but it worked. It was viable and in the interest of the WRU at that time that it worked. Will it still be viable in a few years? It is the future that concerns me.

I understand the concern, but they are pretty much a model landlord.
Did they have to organise the investment in the pitch? - no they didn't.
Did they have to organise the investment in new electronic advertising? - no they didn't

Who does it benefit? - it's mutual benefit isn't it, as we are by far the main user of those facilities.

Think of the WRU as a facility provider. They provide the facilities for us to use and make money, and we rent those facilities.

The last board minutes confirmed that the club has made a profit for the last 4 seasons. We are hardly being screwed are we? The minutes also confirmed that the electronic advertising sales were up, and most of next season sorted. Mutual benefit.

Now if we are relegated, it's possible that we won't need to rent some of that electronic advertising. Mutual loss, etc, etc.

The WRU are business orientated, they will look at what we offer, and what alternatives they have, and weigh up whether it would be better for us to say swap grounds with Newport Rugby. Now having just levered them out, do you think they would be in any rush to invite them back? Will they rent more facilities than County do?

Flexibility is the way to survive, Coventry have learnt that the hard way. County had to be more than flexible as well. It's sad then to note what happened to the ground owners at Moreton in the Marsh and Gloucester.

Well I am glad that you understand my concern.

The WRU may be business oriented, they certainly are a facility provider, no problem with that. I may be wrong and I am pretty sure that someone will let me know if I am, but I cannot think of any rugby business, whether it be National Union or club that provides facilities to only a football club in this country. That may happen to us in the future if things don’t go our way.

Should this nightmare scenario happen, I think even the members of the WRU would be asking them why they are providing a facility to a football club when the money could be spent elsewhere. Goodwill is everything, unfortunately we cannot guarantee that it remains if things go downhill.

I think the best scenario is if the Dragons move/fold or whatever, and that is a distinct possibility, that the WRU see sense and ask the club or the Council to somehow buy RP. How we or the Council would arrange the finances for that I don’t know. I am not a planning expert or a financial expert but if we can’t rent RP for whatever reason in the future that may be the only option.

It is a very fluid situation at the moment and any ideas that we have may be superseded in the not too distant future.

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 2:04 pm

What will be will be however, and if you plan for disaster, sooner or later you will get your wish.

County-at-the-races wrote: May 9th, 2022, 3:26 pm I've said this numerous times over the years and I know it's 'business speak' but.....
Plan to fail, not fail to plan.

Whilst you can't prepare for every possibility you can surely plan for the big events and in football terms that is relegation and a place to play.
Players come, players go. Managers come, managers go. Sometimes you'll have too much rain and other times not enough, but you really need a contingency plan for the big two things above.

Stan A. Einstein wrote: May 9th, 2022, 4:01 pm

County-at-the-races wrote: May 9th, 2022, 3:26 pm I've said this numerous times over the years and I know it's 'business speak' but.....
Plan to fail, not fail to plan.

Whilst you can't prepare for every possibility you can surely plan for the big events and in football terms that is relegation and a place to play.
Players come, players go. Managers come, managers go. Sometimes you'll have too much rain and other times not enough, but you really need a contingency plan for the big two things above.

Quite.

I hold the view that our relationship with the WRU is unequal. As a consequence we are not in control of our own destiny. It is open to anyone to disagree with me but as yet I have not heard a convincing argument as to why firstly that the WRU will under all future circumstances ensure our future at Rodney Parade. And secondly if the WRU ever do decide that our presence is no longer in their interest that we have a plan as to how to mitigate this.

The only argument I have seen is from one contributor who keeps up the mantra that many rugby and football teams share a stadium. It must be in double figures now that I think County and Dragons sharing a stadium makes perfect sense. My problem is that as things stand County are in effect paying for the Bisley stand and improvements in the playing surface. Imagine ten years hence. Covered terracing at both ends of the pitch. A new 3,000 seat west stand. And a statement from the Dragons.

Thanks to our friends from Newport County for all their help in financing our great new stadium. All that remains for us to do is to wish Newport County all the very best as they return to Spytty.

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 2:04 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 9th, 2022, 11:52 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 10:34 am

pembsexile wrote: May 9th, 2022, 9:03 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 8th, 2022, 2:18 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 8th, 2022, 1:00 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 8th, 2022, 12:07 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 7th, 2022, 6:06 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 7th, 2022, 10:48 am

pembsexile wrote: May 7th, 2022, 10:11 am

Yet another straw man argument.

Diverting attention? Have a look at my post on this thread at 9.43am yesterday where I responded to you.

Exactly, precisely.
Has it never a occurred to you that the County are in the best situation that they could be. I. E. Having a landlord that requires them in order to make the ground viable? Just think about that..........

Now I don't know if the ground is viable with just the County as the sole user, but I know for sure that it isn't viable without them.

Now Consider Coventry City, owned Highfield Road. Wanted a bigger ground and the Council wanted them to move, hence the Rioch. Attendence fell to the point where the stadium wasn't viable for them and the owners (a charitable trust and the local council) and they had to move away until it became viable again.

Now consider Newport Rugby, no longer viable to play at RP moved away, doing better.

Also consider Bristol City and the Bristol Bears that play there. They lost the memorial ground to Bristol Rovers, who has done better?

You are falling into Stans trap of believing that because the ownership of RP is with the WRU, that they wish to do us harm, and that is the basis of the discussion. It simply isn't an argument that has any merit.


Why don't you consider the evidence, the WRU are just a landlord looking after something that needs to be viable.

I have studied planning in Wales, which is important, because planning is devolved, and I know what is required even to get to outline planning consent. The Council moved various sports to Spytty, but always provided an alternative
Facility. So to build on RP the first thing they would require is where is the alternative facility being constructed and detail benifit, and the need of the realeasd site. Road network and access statements. A community statement, an environmental impact assessment, etc, etc.

Another thing to consider is that the WRU pay 80% of each of the Regions Welsh players wages. So the income that the Regions receive from bums on seats is far less.

The bottom line is this. We don't require cement, when what we are bringing to the table makes the venue viable.

What on earth do you mean by ‘Precisely. Exactly’? My previous comment could hardly be construed to mean that I was diverting attention from a serious issue could it? I just wish some people on here (not just you) would refer to what people actually say, instead of what they think people say. Furthermore, other people, including you used the word cement in their post before I did. Cementing our position as the premier sporting club in Newport is a sound proposition. How do we do that is the question.

I think I made it quite clear in my post yesterday that I am certainly not a planning expert but I do have opinions and ideas. Nothing more, nothing less. Certainly no diversionary tactics from me.

Quote from Stan....

Morning Colin,

My plan is really simple.

First step is that we acknowledge the problem.

Second step is that we politely explain to those who wish to bury their heads in the sand, that that is no longer an option.

Third step is that we speak to all the clubs who have developed their own stadiums and ask them how they managed to do it. What worked and as importantly what didn't.

Step four is to engage with the fan base and start to work towards our aim, together.

Step five is we listen to everyone who wants to help.

Step 6. We ignore those who are so narrow minded that they believe nothing can be done

Now that sets the tone of there is a problem, and the solution to solving it, is speaking to clubs about how to develop their own stadium, nothing else is to be considered.
Torquay Exile asks a question of Stan, and you respond on his behalf. So Torquay Exile asks if you are Stan? and gets abused. That's diversion.

Then I am not allowed by you to ask the question, why is cementing a relationship at Rodney Parade a unique problem to County when ground shares happen regularly all around the Country? You refuse to answer, by basically telling me I am not allowed to ask that, as the question should be how can WE do so? Ignoring the point that I am making, that we have already. Then you complain about my use of the word Cement. Again this is just diversion.

If you and Stan spent some time researching what clubs are doing now, they are sharing. Why are they doing that, and ignoring the holy grail of cementing sporting supremacy?

It appears that you like to twist what I actually say to suit your own narrative. That is your prerogative. Read again what I have said on this thread and there is no way that I have told you that you are not allowed to ask anything. You have completely made this up. I, or anyone else have no right to say to anyone that they are not allowed to ask a question. What I have done is suggest an alternative question. People do it all the time. That is completely different to what you suggest.

Furthermore, I have not complained about your use of the word cement. In the context it is being used, it is a good word. I even used it myself after other people had. I am merely pointing out that it had been used by others. You jump on it and say it is a diversion tactic. Absolute nonsense.

The start of this thread made the point that the WRU may be looking to cut the number of Welsh clubs to three from four. I wonder who the favourite for revamping/reorganising/culling are? That concerns me.

So that people understand my view and It doesn’t get twisted, here it is:

We have been fortunate since 2012 to have an agreement with Dragons, then WRU to use RP (Tfft). I am glad we moved there. I was there yesterday along with over 5300 others supporting our team. I used to even go over to see the Dragons some years ago but don’t anymore. They are on a bad (seemingly inescapable) slide unfortunately. In the context of ground sharing our fortunes are inextricably linked to them. There is no escaping that. We are the prime tenant at the moment and probably contribute more money than the Dragons. What happens if we slide into the Conference?

What about the future?

As far as priorities go, our number one priority next season should be cementing our position as Newport’s premier sporting club by trying to ensure that we carry on with L2 survival. That is paramount. Whilst important, anything else is secondary.

Again, why is sliding into the conference a problem in relation to Rodney Parade? we have played there before in the conference rather successfully, and made the ground viable. I'm not arguing that we should try to be in the Conference, just why is it a problem?

My argument about cementing our position as Newport premier sporting club is what difference does it make?

If as you say our relationship at Rodney Parade concerns you, what do you have against researching why ground shares happen regularly all around the Country?

Don't you want to know the answer?

I completely understand that you are not arguing that we should try to be in the National league (Conference). No one who is a County fan would want that.

With the associated fall in revenue, I believe that sliding into the National league (Conference) would be a backward step. Probable dwindling support, lower club income and facing an uphill struggle to get back in the league.

In my previous post I said (Tfft) that we have been ground sharing with the rugby at RP for a decade. If we hadn’t gone to RP I don’t think we would have had the relatively few good years in L2. The status quo is working as it is. It is not perfect, it is not ideal but at this stage it is the best we can get. Ground sharing works for us at the moment.

My concerns are twofold;

1 Given the article in the Times about the possibility of the WRU culling one club in Wales, the probability (not certainty) is that one of the teams will be the Dragons. Our future is linked with them as at the moment we appear to be the primary tenant (financially). They appear to be going backwards unfortunately. If they go, in the eyes of our Landlord, is RP sustainable with only a football club paying rent? We will never know what is inside their heads but I cannot see the WRU in that event saying yes, we should support the County at RP. I sincerely hope that the Dragons improve. Two clubs can be catered for at RP.

2. Our recent form is dire. If that carries on into next season there is more than a real possibility that we could find ourselves heading towards the National league with all the disadvantages that holds. It is of paramount importance that we retain L2 status at the end of next season. I just hope we get the right players in.

If ground sharing works for other clubs, then good on them. If it ain’t broke, then why fix it. Unfortunately, we could be heading in the need to ‘fix it’ direction.

When we were last in the Conference and then went to RP, the Dragons were successful. They had far larger crowds than us. It was not a perfect relationship but it worked. It was viable and in the interest of the WRU at that time that it worked. Will it still be viable in a few years? It is the future that concerns me.

I understand the concern, but they are pretty much a model landlord.
Did they have to organise the investment in the pitch? - no they didn't.
Did they have to organise the investment in new electronic advertising? - no they didn't

Who does it benefit? - it's mutual benefit isn't it, as we are by far the main user of those facilities.

Think of the WRU as a facility provider. They provide the facilities for us to use and make money, and we rent those facilities.

The last board minutes confirmed that the club has made a profit for the last 4 seasons. We are hardly being screwed are we? The minutes also confirmed that the electronic advertising sales were up, and most of next season sorted. Mutual benefit.

Now if we are relegated, it's possible that we won't need to rent some of that electronic advertising. Mutual loss, etc, etc.

The WRU are business orientated, they will look at what we offer, and what alternatives they have, and weigh up whether it would be better for us to say swap grounds with Newport Rugby. Now having just levered them out, do you think they would be in any rush to invite them back? Will they rent more facilities than County do?

Flexibility is the way to survive, Coventry have learnt that the hard way. County had to be more than flexible as well. It's sad then to note what happened to the ground owners at Moreton in the Marsh and Gloucester.

Well I am glad that you understand my concern.

The WRU may be business oriented, they certainly are a facility provider, no problem with that. I may be wrong and I am pretty sure that someone will let me know if I am, but I cannot think of any rugby business, whether it be National Union or club that provides facilities to only a football club in this country. That may happen to us in the future if things don’t go our way.

Should this nightmare scenario happen, I think even the members of the WRU would be asking them why they are providing a facility to a football club when the money could be spent elsewhere. Goodwill is everything, unfortunately we cannot guarantee that it remains if things go downhill.

I think the best scenario is if the Dragons move/fold or whatever, and that is a distinct possibility, that the WRU see sense and ask the club or the Council to somehow buy RP. How we or the Council would arrange the finances for that I don’t know. I am not a planning expert or a financial expert but if we can’t rent RP for whatever reason in the future that may be the only option.

It is a very fluid situation at the moment and any ideas that we have may be superseded in the not too distant future.

Personally I wouldn't trust the Council to invest as the WRU have done. You need to keep investing to reap the rewards,and as a facility manager they know what to spend the cash on.
As you were there on Saturday you probably noticed that pre-match is more orchestrated, with music that the fans chant with, and builds an atmosphere. It works in the scense that the crowds have been good even though home form is as bad as it ever has been.
Goals are celebrated on the electronic screens etc.
Night games have flames and coordinating music. All small things, but it all adds up to a feel good atmosphere, that you are at an event worth seeing.

The WRU know from past experience what does and doesn't work in terms of pitch drainage etc. It just has a more professional feel to the place.

What will be will be however, and if you plan for disaster, sooner or later you will get your wish.

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 8:14 pm Well, I remember this forum going into meltdown because it was rumoured that the club were exploring a fallback position, of playing at FGR among others, a number of years ago.

Some were not exactly pleased that we played games at the Cardiff City Stadium during covid.

I don't think that planning for worst case is very productive. What if Tan and Cardiff go pop? Do they have a plan?

pembsexile wrote: May 9th, 2022, 7:31 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 2:04 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 9th, 2022, 11:52 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 10:34 am

pembsexile wrote: May 9th, 2022, 9:03 am

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 8th, 2022, 2:18 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 8th, 2022, 1:00 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 8th, 2022, 12:07 pm

pembsexile wrote: May 7th, 2022, 6:06 pm

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 7th, 2022, 10:48 am

Exactly, precisely.
Has it never a occurred to you that the County are in the best situation that they could be. I. E. Having a landlord that requires them in order to make the ground viable? Just think about that..........

Now I don't know if the ground is viable with just the County as the sole user, but I know for sure that it isn't viable without them.

Now Consider Coventry City, owned Highfield Road. Wanted a bigger ground and the Council wanted them to move, hence the Rioch. Attendence fell to the point where the stadium wasn't viable for them and the owners (a charitable trust and the local council) and they had to move away until it became viable again.

Now consider Newport Rugby, no longer viable to play at RP moved away, doing better.

Also consider Bristol City and the Bristol Bears that play there. They lost the memorial ground to Bristol Rovers, who has done better?

You are falling into Stans trap of believing that because the ownership of RP is with the WRU, that they wish to do us harm, and that is the basis of the discussion. It simply isn't an argument that has any merit.


Why don't you consider the evidence, the WRU are just a landlord looking after something that needs to be viable.

I have studied planning in Wales, which is important, because planning is devolved, and I know what is required even to get to outline planning consent. The Council moved various sports to Spytty, but always provided an alternative
Facility. So to build on RP the first thing they would require is where is the alternative facility being constructed and detail benifit, and the need of the realeasd site. Road network and access statements. A community statement, an environmental impact assessment, etc, etc.

Another thing to consider is that the WRU pay 80% of each of the Regions Welsh players wages. So the income that the Regions receive from bums on seats is far less.

The bottom line is this. We don't require cement, when what we are bringing to the table makes the venue viable.

What on earth do you mean by ‘Precisely. Exactly’? My previous comment could hardly be construed to mean that I was diverting attention from a serious issue could it? I just wish some people on here (not just you) would refer to what people actually say, instead of what they think people say. Furthermore, other people, including you used the word cement in their post before I did. Cementing our position as the premier sporting club in Newport is a sound proposition. How do we do that is the question.

I think I made it quite clear in my post yesterday that I am certainly not a planning expert but I do have opinions and ideas. Nothing more, nothing less. Certainly no diversionary tactics from me.

Quote from Stan....

Morning Colin,

My plan is really simple.

First step is that we acknowledge the problem.

Second step is that we politely explain to those who wish to bury their heads in the sand, that that is no longer an option.

Third step is that we speak to all the clubs who have developed their own stadiums and ask them how they managed to do it. What worked and as importantly what didn't.

Step four is to engage with the fan base and start to work towards our aim, together.

Step five is we listen to everyone who wants to help.

Step 6. We ignore those who are so narrow minded that they believe nothing can be done

Now that sets the tone of there is a problem, and the solution to solving it, is speaking to clubs about how to develop their own stadium, nothing else is to be considered.
Torquay Exile asks a question of Stan, and you respond on his behalf. So Torquay Exile asks if you are Stan? and gets abused. That's diversion.

Then I am not allowed by you to ask the question, why is cementing a relationship at Rodney Parade a unique problem to County when ground shares happen regularly all around the Country? You refuse to answer, by basically telling me I am not allowed to ask that, as the question should be how can WE do so? Ignoring the point that I am making, that we have already. Then you complain about my use of the word Cement. Again this is just diversion.

If you and Stan spent some time researching what clubs are doing now, they are sharing. Why are they doing that, and ignoring the holy grail of cementing sporting supremacy?

It appears that you like to twist what I actually say to suit your own narrative. That is your prerogative. Read again what I have said on this thread and there is no way that I have told you that you are not allowed to ask anything. You have completely made this up. I, or anyone else have no right to say to anyone that they are not allowed to ask a question. What I have done is suggest an alternative question. People do it all the time. That is completely different to what you suggest.

Furthermore, I have not complained about your use of the word cement. In the context it is being used, it is a good word. I even used it myself after other people had. I am merely pointing out that it had been used by others. You jump on it and say it is a diversion tactic. Absolute nonsense.

The start of this thread made the point that the WRU may be looking to cut the number of Welsh clubs to three from four. I wonder who the favourite for revamping/reorganising/culling are? That concerns me.

So that people understand my view and It doesn’t get twisted, here it is:

We have been fortunate since 2012 to have an agreement with Dragons, then WRU to use RP (Tfft). I am glad we moved there. I was there yesterday along with over 5300 others supporting our team. I used to even go over to see the Dragons some years ago but don’t anymore. They are on a bad (seemingly inescapable) slide unfortunately. In the context of ground sharing our fortunes are inextricably linked to them. There is no escaping that. We are the prime tenant at the moment and probably contribute more money than the Dragons. What happens if we slide into the Conference?

What about the future?

As far as priorities go, our number one priority next season should be cementing our position as Newport’s premier sporting club by trying to ensure that we carry on with L2 survival. That is paramount. Whilst important, anything else is secondary.

Again, why is sliding into the conference a problem in relation to Rodney Parade? we have played there before in the conference rather successfully, and made the ground viable. I'm not arguing that we should try to be in the Conference, just why is it a problem?

My argument about cementing our position as Newport premier sporting club is what difference does it make?

If as you say our relationship at Rodney Parade concerns you, what do you have against researching why ground shares happen regularly all around the Country?

Don't you want to know the answer?

I completely understand that you are not arguing that we should try to be in the National league (Conference). No one who is a County fan would want that.

With the associated fall in revenue, I believe that sliding into the National league (Conference) would be a backward step. Probable dwindling support, lower club income and facing an uphill struggle to get back in the league.

In my previous post I said (Tfft) that we have been ground sharing with the rugby at RP for a decade. If we hadn’t gone to RP I don’t think we would have had the relatively few good years in L2. The status quo is working as it is. It is not perfect, it is not ideal but at this stage it is the best we can get. Ground sharing works for us at the moment.

My concerns are twofold;

1 Given the article in the Times about the possibility of the WRU culling one club in Wales, the probability (not certainty) is that one of the teams will be the Dragons. Our future is linked with them as at the moment we appear to be the primary tenant (financially). They appear to be going backwards unfortunately. If they go, in the eyes of our Landlord, is RP sustainable with only a football club paying rent? We will never know what is inside their heads but I cannot see the WRU in that event saying yes, we should support the County at RP. I sincerely hope that the Dragons improve. Two clubs can be catered for at RP.

2. Our recent form is dire. If that carries on into next season there is more than a real possibility that we could find ourselves heading towards the National league with all the disadvantages that holds. It is of paramount importance that we retain L2 status at the end of next season. I just hope we get the right players in.

If ground sharing works for other clubs, then good on them. If it ain’t broke, then why fix it. Unfortunately, we could be heading in the need to ‘fix it’ direction.

When we were last in the Conference and then went to RP, the Dragons were successful. They had far larger crowds than us. It was not a perfect relationship but it worked. It was viable and in the interest of the WRU at that time that it worked. Will it still be viable in a few years? It is the future that concerns me.

I understand the concern, but they are pretty much a model landlord.
Did they have to organise the investment in the pitch? - no they didn't.
Did they have to organise the investment in new electronic advertising? - no they didn't

Who does it benefit? - it's mutual benefit isn't it, as we are by far the main user of those facilities.

Think of the WRU as a facility provider. They provide the facilities for us to use and make money, and we rent those facilities.

The last board minutes confirmed that the club has made a profit for the last 4 seasons. We are hardly being screwed are we? The minutes also confirmed that the electronic advertising sales were up, and most of next season sorted. Mutual benefit.

Now if we are relegated, it's possible that we won't need to rent some of that electronic advertising. Mutual loss, etc, etc.

The WRU are business orientated, they will look at what we offer, and what alternatives they have, and weigh up whether it would be better for us to say swap grounds with Newport Rugby. Now having just levered them out, do you think they would be in any rush to invite them back? Will they rent more facilities than County do?

Flexibility is the way to survive, Coventry have learnt that the hard way. County had to be more than flexible as well. It's sad then to note what happened to the ground owners at Moreton in the Marsh and Gloucester.

Well I am glad that you understand my concern.

The WRU may be business oriented, they certainly are a facility provider, no problem with that. I may be wrong and I am pretty sure that someone will let me know if I am, but I cannot think of any rugby business, whether it be National Union or club that provides facilities to only a football club in this country. That may happen to us in the future if things don’t go our way.

Should this nightmare scenario happen, I think even the members of the WRU would be asking them why they are providing a facility to a football club when the money could be spent elsewhere. Goodwill is everything, unfortunately we cannot guarantee that it remains if things go downhill.

I think the best scenario is if the Dragons move/fold or whatever, and that is a distinct possibility, that the WRU see sense and ask the club or the Council to somehow buy RP. How we or the Council would arrange the finances for that I don’t know. I am not a planning expert or a financial expert but if we can’t rent RP for whatever reason in the future that may be the only option.

It is a very fluid situation at the moment and any ideas that we have may be superseded in the not too distant future.

Personally I wouldn't trust the Council to invest as the WRU have done. You need to keep investing to reap the rewards,and as a facility manager they know what to spend the cash on.
As you were there on Saturday you probably noticed that pre-match is more orchestrated, with music that the fans chant with, and builds an atmosphere. It works in the scense that the crowds have been good even though home form is as bad as it ever has been.
Goals are celebrated on the electronic screens etc.
Night games have flames and coordinating music. All small things, but it all adds up to a feel good atmosphere, that you are at an event worth seeing.

The WRU know from past experience what does and doesn't work in terms of pitch drainage etc. It just has a more professional feel to the place.

What will be will be however, and if you plan for disaster, sooner or later you will get your wish.

Whose wish? Planning for disaster, wishing for disaster. I’ve not seen or read anything in the public domain or on this messageboard where a fan has wanted that. That is what everyone wants to avoid.

Bangitintrnet wrote: May 9th, 2022, 8:14 pm Well, I remember this forum going into meltdown because it was rumoured that the club were exploring a fallback position, of playing at FGR among others, a number of years ago.

Some were not exactly pleased that we played games at the Cardiff City Stadium during covid.

I don't think that planning for worst case is very productive. What if Tan and Cardiff go pop? Do they have a plan?